Game 30: Separated Scum

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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Lila C. on Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:17 pm

Is anyone else confused about what titus is on about or am I just misunderstanding?
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by O O. on Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:28 pm

Lila C. wrote:Is anyone else confused about what titus is on about or am I just misunderstanding?
all the mafia are traitors so they dont know their partners
also titus putting out the reasoning in his post literally makes it so that any benefit from doing that would be removed so that's just a waste of time at this point
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by O O. on Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:29 pm

"1 Traitor Roleblocker Cop, 1 Traitor 1-Shot Vigilante Cop, 1 Traitor Cop, 1 Compulsive Vigilante, 6 Vanilla Townies, 1 Hidden Miller (sees itself as Vanilla Townie, reveals as Vanilla Townie on death)"
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Linda G. on Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:42 pm

There's a slip by O O. to try and get town cred: Mafia vigilante is One Shot. lynch O O. the mafia vigilante, case closed. I'll take your questions throughout the day, but I'll pre-emptively answer a few of the ones I'm expecting

1) "What happened to your crusade against Lila C.?"
it was lila z not lila c. now that i have rechecked the player list, i realize i mistook the current lila as someone much prettier, and so i'm confident in my position as the prettiest avatar in game.
2) "Seriously?"
yes. no more questions about the crusade at this time please
3) "But she also slipped, not knowing the mafia don't know each other, isn't that why you're lynching O O.?"
It is, but that happened while I was typing this up, and lila c actually had some good posts yesterday, as compared to O O. who didn't do much of anything, and is now trying to show that he does know things, by correcting her. Literally, his entire D1 was confirm, rand lynch, agree + change lynch. Coming out strong D2 isn't helping O O.'s case, whereas Lila's early D2 posts are an actual continuation of a D1 topic.
3) "Are you going to lynch O O. over something that they said at the beginning of the day, and not give any comments about what happened at the end of yesterday?"
Breaking this down into two parts: a) am I going to lynch O O. over beginning of day?
Yes. his posts yesterday were low effort, low quality, and led to a mislynch of a townie.
b) what about yesterday?
have some comments about yesterday:

Titus makes some posts that I really like, and quality > quantity. Bonus points for having an average avatar, and making the response of "can't really defend against a gut read, please give actual reasoning" (I changed the phrasing, but that's my interpretation of what he said), however his posts do remind me of a thing I'd like to say.

When you're quoting people's quotes of quotes, start to remove the inside quotes once they stop being the relevant parts of the quote. Like now, I'm lynching O O. Someone could quote this post and say "your reasoning is garbage, b lynch Linda G. /b" and that post will be directly referencing what I said, so it's fine. it's low effort, and i hate low effort, but the quote doesn't need to be collapsed. but once we start hitting the third or fourth layer of quotes, do we really need my original statements still in the post? go into the quote, and remove the part of {quote}Linda G. wrote: {/quote} bullshit. wall posts are horrendous enough in these forum games, no need to exacerbate them.

other than Titus' play, I like Marilyn's defense, even if I agree that her UL was weak and scummy (looking back, originally I thought nothing of it). and that's essentially all the important stuff that happened yesterday. lynching a townie is always regrettable, but Amelia had 5 posts, none of which had any substance whatsoever. not a big loss when we need power players and lots of effort from everyone.

in conclusion: O O. is scum, Titus is town, and collapse your quotes. thank you.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Linda G. on Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:43 pm

good ole fashioned wall post, getting the job done queen
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Titus V. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:29 am

Lila C. wrote:Is anyone else confused about what titus is on about or am I just misunderstanding?

Sigh... Let me just try to put it in another way. Mafias, as pointed out by OO., are traitors and thus do not know their partners. Considering that a dead mafia is worse to them than a dead vt is to town, each lynch they make is inherently riskier than any lynch a town makes. Therefore, this leads me to a conclusion that mafias will be reluctant to lynch.

The second point I want to make is the importance of read-lists. While town is playing a game of "who's the scummiest", mafia is playing a game of "who's NOT the scummiest" so they don't lynch their own partners. This is why I think read-lists will be useful to help us - let's say there's a particular player where the majority of players think is the scummiest. This player will be the scummiest on most players' readlist. However, the mafias might think that this player is one of their partner and mentioned someone else that should be lynched instead (chainsaw defense). Saying this out loud may make the strategy less useful, but the result should be interesting and helpful nevertheless.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Lila C. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:57 am

oh right my bad im stupid af

anyway I'd like to hear something of a bit more substance from Yuzo K., most of their posts so far have just been about the vig and how we should decide on kills iirc, any reads?
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Linda G. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:35 am

More good stuff from Titus, albeit sarcastically and in a manner that wasn't helpful at all. So like, the content was good, but the timings was less so. I'll give you more points for the read list comment, and I'll post my very own read list!

O O. - See post above
Marilyn - Wasn't she the counterwagon until we lynched off an idle player? Rubs me as scum from her unlynch as well as lack of presence
Yuzo / Hiroki / Nicolette - haven't made an impression on me that I can remember. post more, make them good, make an effort.
Teaque - Made a lynch based on a read, received a defense, and altered that read. Good town play, but not good enough to receive a top two spot on my list for townies
Lila - Been doing good things by keeping the chat alive, and isn't as cute as I am.
Titus - You've never done a thing wrong in your life and you should know that.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by O O. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:54 am

Linda G. wrote:There's a slip by O O. to try and get town cred: Mafia vigilante is One Shot. lynch O O. the mafia vigilante, case closed. I'll take your questions throughout the day, but I'll pre-emptively answer a few of the ones I'm expecting

1) "What happened to your crusade against Lila C.?"
it was lila z not lila c. now that i have rechecked the player list, i realize i mistook the current lila as someone much prettier, and so i'm confident in my position as the prettiest avatar in game.
2) "Seriously?"
yes. no more questions about the crusade at this time please
3) "But she also slipped, not knowing the mafia don't know each other, isn't that why you're lynching O O.?"
It is, but that happened while I was typing this up, and lila c actually had some good posts yesterday, as compared to O O. who didn't do much of anything, and is now trying to show that he does know things, by correcting her. Literally, his entire D1 was confirm, rand lynch, agree + change lynch. Coming out strong D2 isn't helping O O.'s case, whereas Lila's early D2 posts are an actual continuation of a D1 topic.
3) "Are you going to lynch O O. over something that they said at the beginning of the day, and not give any comments about what happened at the end of yesterday?"
Breaking this down into two parts: a) am I going to lynch O O. over beginning of day?
Yes. his posts yesterday were low effort, low quality, and led to a mislynch of a townie.
b) what about yesterday?
have some comments about yesterday:

Titus makes some posts that I really like, and quality > quantity. Bonus points for having an average avatar, and making the response of "can't really defend against a gut read, please give actual reasoning" (I changed the phrasing, but that's my interpretation of what he said), however his posts do remind me of a thing I'd like to say.

When you're quoting people's quotes of quotes, start to remove the inside quotes once they stop being the relevant parts of the quote. Like now, I'm lynching O O. Someone could quote this post and say "your reasoning is garbage, b lynch Linda G. /b" and that post will be directly referencing what I said, so it's fine. it's low effort, and i hate low effort, but the quote doesn't need to be collapsed. but once we start hitting the third or fourth layer of quotes, do we really need my original statements still in the post? go into the quote, and remove the part of {quote}Linda G. wrote: {/quote} bullshit. wall posts are horrendous enough in these forum games, no need to exacerbate them.

other than Titus' play, I like Marilyn's defense, even if I agree that her UL was weak and scummy (looking back, originally I thought nothing of it). and that's essentially all the important stuff that happened yesterday. lynching a townie is always regrettable, but Amelia had 5 posts, none of which had any substance whatsoever. not a big loss when we need power players and lots of effort from everyone.

in conclusion: O O. is scum, Titus is town, and collapse your quotes. thank you.
i get the rest so explain the bolded part pls thx
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Linda G. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:40 am

O O. wrote:
Linda G. wrote:Coming out strong D2 isn't helping O O.'s case

When you're quoting people's quotes of quotes, start to remove the inside quotes once they stop being the relevant parts of the quote. Like now, I'm lynching O O. Someone could quote this post and say "your reasoning is garbage, b lynch Linda G. /b" and that post will be directly referencing what I said, so it's fine. it's low effort, and i hate low effort, but the quote doesn't need to be collapsed. but once we start hitting the third or fourth layer of quotes, do we really need my original statements still in the post? go into the quote, and remove the part of {quote}Linda G. wrote: {/quote} bullshit. wall posts are horrendous enough in these forum games, no need to exacerbate them.
i get the rest so explain the bolded part pls thx

this is what I meant with the underlined part, collapse ur quotes. that post is large AF to just ask for clarification over eight words.

the bolded part is essentially you did nothing D1, absolutely nothing. people can go back and check, D1 was less than two pages long. you come in late with some insight on yesterday, a day that's already over. then you check the thread more often than anyone else apparently, and help out Lila with setup talk. but then while pointing out the setup talk, you gloss over your own slip.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Marilyn M. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 5:34 am

O O. wrote:looking back i think that marilyn made a rather large deal out of her unlynch, maybe even an excessive one. I don't really understand why people were getting on her for "not having a good reason to unlynch," but maybe i'm just misunderstanding them

When I posted it, I did feel like i was making a rather large deal out of it, but I was the counterwagon, and was a plurshift away from dying, so I think defending myself like that was justifiable

Lila C. wrote:
Titus V. wrote:
Lila C. wrote:
Also lmao, what even? "I doubt that scum will lynch today because they could lynch themselves".

Where exactly did I say that? All I am saying is mafia have no reason to aggressively push a lynch today because they have no need to risk lynching one of their partners.

Anyways, I suggest that as the game goes on a little bit everyone should make a read list ordering the players from most townie to most scummy. This way, we can see how everyone ranks every player. Since the mafia wants to avoid lynching scummy players since they don't want to target their own members, they would need to list those they suspect higher on the list (as more townie). Their lists might contradict a lot of town opinions so it might be helpful to help us scumhunt.
So you think there's a chance of mafia aggressively lynching one of their own on day 1... my point stands.

"Since the mafia wants to avoid lynching scummy players since they don't want to target their own members".

You do realize mafia knows their partners right?

First of all, Titus is awesome
Second of all, Lila C. is either an idiot town or scum trying to get towncred, but I'm not bying it.
There is no way someone couldnt realise there were traitors in the game, and this seems very forced. I didnt quote it but I noticed she said something similair to this on day 1, which makes me really unsure, either she actually didnt know about the traitors, or she is attempting to force it down our throats that she 'didnt know' mafia were traitors

Linda G. wrote:There's a slip by O O. to try and get town cred: Mafia vigilante is One Shot. lynch O O. the mafia vigilante, case closed.

1) "What happened to your crusade against Lila C.?"
it was lila z not lila c. now that i have rechecked the player list, i realize i mistook the current lila as someone much prettier, and so i'm confident in my position as the prettiest avatar in game.
2) "Seriously?"
yes. no more questions about the crusade at this time please
3) "But she also slipped, not knowing the mafia don't know each other, isn't that why you're lynching O O.?"
It is, but that happened while I was typing this up, and lila c actually had some good posts yesterday, as compared to O O. who didn't do much of anything, and is now trying to show that he does know things, by correcting her. Literally, his entire D1 was confirm, rand lynch, agree + change lynch. Coming out strong D2 isn't helping O O.'s case, whereas Lila's early D2 posts are an actual continuation of a D1 topic.
3) "Are you going to lynch O O. over something that they said at the beginning of the day, and not give any comments about what happened at the end of yesterday?"
Breaking this down into two parts: a) am I going to lynch O O. over beginning of day?
Yes. his posts yesterday were low effort, low quality, and led to a mislynch of a townie.
b) what about yesterday?
have some comments about yesterday:

Titus makes some posts that I really like, and quality > quantity. Bonus points for having an average avatar, and making the response of "can't really defend against a gut read, please give actual reasoning" (I changed the phrasing, but that's my interpretation of what he said), however his posts do remind me of a thing I'd like to say.

other than Titus' play, I like Marilyn's defense, even if I agree that her UL was weak and scummy (looking back, originally I thought nothing of it). and that's essentially all the important stuff that happened yesterday. lynching a townie is always regrettable, but Amelia had 5 posts, none of which had any substance whatsoever. not a big loss when we need power players and lots of effort from everyone.

in conclusion: O O. is scum, Titus is town, and collapse your quotes. thank you.

Point 0: I think thats a very harsh reasoning to lynch someone, but you do justify it later on.
Point 1+2: Really? I agree its great to break down the quotes and I've been trying to do that, can you also please cut down useless filler out of your own posts if they are long. This is mostly useless filler, as I wasnt planning on, and I doubt others were either, questioning the crusade against Lila
Point 3: Having read day 1, and looked at Lila's posts on her profile, I dont think either posted very useful posts. Granted, neither did I, but I really dont understand why you are anti-O and not very anti-Lila. It seems harsh to say it but i would be tempted to believe that Linda is mafia and thinks/knows Lila is one of the traitors? Im not saying that as a hard read just as something to consider
Coming from this, be on the lookout for players suddenly not scumreading their scumreads. This could be due to the traitor cop finding them as mafia
the Other Point 3?: I already commented on this, O certainly didnt have good posts, but neither did basically anyone apart from God's creation Titus
Point 3b: Agreed on Titus part, and actually agreed on Marilyn part too. When i saw the scumreads on me I was confused, but looking back they were fairly justifiable for a day 1 read as it was the best they could go by.

Titus V. wrote:

The second point I want to make is the importance of read-lists. While town is playing a game of "who's the scummiest", mafia is playing a game of "who's NOT the scummiest" so they don't lynch their own partners. This is why I think read-lists will be useful to help us - let's say there's a particular player where the majority of players think is the scummiest. This player will be the scummiest on most players' readlist. However, the mafias might think that this player is one of their partner and mentioned someone else that should be lynched instead (chainsaw defense). Saying this out loud may make the strategy less useful, but the result should be interesting and helpful nevertheless.

Agreed, Readlists are going to be interesting to look at and I believe Linda has one posted already

Lila C. wrote:oh right my bad im stupid af

anyway I'd like to hear something of a bit more substance from Yuzo K., most of their posts so far have just been about the vig and how we should decide on kills iirc, any reads?
and what have you done apart from be confused about traitors.
Where are YOUR reads (mine are in the next post hopefully)

Linda G. wrote:
O O. - See post above
Marilyn - Wasn't she the counterwagon until we lynched off an idle player? Rubs me as scum from her unlynch as well as lack of presence
Yuzo / Hiroki / Nicolette - haven't made an impression on me that I can remember. post more, make them good, make an effort.
Teaque - Made a lynch based on a read, received a defense, and altered that read. Good town play, but not good enough to receive a top two spot on my list for townies
Lila - Been doing good things by keeping the chat alive, and isn't as cute as I am.
Titus - You've never done a thing wrong in your life and you should know that.

Opinions on this- O.O: See my response to your post (It may have came off that I townread O, I dont townread him anymore than other people, I just think it was a harsh lynch as he was no worse than other options
Marilyn- When have I had a lack of presence? If you are talking about the eight hours since day 2 began, I was sleeping because timezones
Y/H/N- all these players are very quiet, I remember a good post from H day 1, and i didnt realise Y was in the game. Didnt Nicolette die?
Teaque- *tips fedora* m'townread
Lila C- if keeping the chat alive is making ignorant posts about the rl, then you are right
Titus- I feel like Linda is hitting on Titus, but Titus is mine so I'm not letting that happen

Linda G. wrote:
O O. wrote:
Linda G. wrote:Coming out strong D2 isn't helping O O.'s case

i get the rest so explain the bolded part pls thx

the bolded part is essentially you did nothing D1, absolutely nothing. people can go back and check, D1 was less than two pages long. you come in late with some insight on yesterday, a day that's already over. then you check the thread more often than anyone else apparently, and help out Lila with setup talk. but then while pointing out the setup talk, you gloss over your own slip.

Surely since day 1 was so short, it means that nobody contributed much? not just O.O?

Oh Wow this post was long. anyway
TL;DR: If you didnt read it you are lazy, read it.

Lynch Lila C.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Marilyn M. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 5:41 am

O O. - Certainly hasnt done much for the game, but their are better options. Neutral/Leaning scum
Linda G. - Made a large post with nice content, but in general was just pro-Titus+Lila and Anti-O (now that I say that I realise my post was mainly Anti-Lila but whatevs) Neutral
Yuzo/Nicolette - who? - neutral
Hiroki M.- Made one good post, but apart from that, who?- Neutral, leaning town
Teaque - *tips fedora* m'townread, m'reusing joke- town
Lila - Hasnt done much to the game, and didnt know there were traitors, potentially for towncred. Scum
Titus - Is awesome, has done nothing but have good ideas in his posts, should pick me over linda- Town
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Marilyn M. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 5:43 am

Hiroki M. wrote:Won't be super active until Saturday when I return from vacation (as you've seen since my last post). Anyway, yes, vig should not claim unless hammer is about to fall on them. The purpose of picking 2 targets for vig to kill each night is that in case we name the vig as our wanted shot that night, they would have a backup without drawing suspicion that they are our vig. One other thing. If we get to the point where we still have 2-3 scum and very few townies (approaching late game) and no successful scum deaths, vig should kinda assume scum has too much town control and shoot whoever tf you want.

Here is Hiroki's post.
He should be back in the next 12 hours hopefully, then we can see what he thinks. But we see HIroki makes a good point, which is why I'm leaning town on him
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Teaque Q. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:52 am

Linda G. wrote:There's a slip by O O. to try and get town cred: Mafia Vigilante is One Shot. lynch O O. the mafia vigilante, case closed. I'll take your questions throughout the day, but I'll pre-emptively answer a few of the ones I'm expecting

Honestly, when I read that post, I had thought that O O. was softing vigilante to set up for a claim later. However, your points are very well thought out, so I'm just going to add onto them a bit and go off my own way.

O O. wrote:
Linda G. wrote:insert content here
I get the rest so explain the bolded part pls thx
This quote right here is what kind of shuts down my ability to tr O O. He was working strong start of Day 2, but as soon as he got scum read, he just went with a short filler post made to seem long. I'm going to say it keeps him in my scum reads, but I'd like to wait for a defence at the very least since O O. hasn't given one yet, and the post makes it seem like he's making one. Currently: Convinced by Linda + O O.'s general scumminess, 80-20 scum town.

Linda's still a town read, starting off extremely strong and explaining reads quite well. 35-65 scum-town
Titus is neutral town, He's extremely helpful to town, but... he never follows his advice? He asks everyone for read posts but doesn't try to start off and make one of his own.
Lila C. has dropped to neutral as of this moment. This whole not knowing about Mafia thing I find extremely unlikely, especially since the name of the game is Separated Scum and she's also the same person to jumped on Amelia for not knowing Rolelist. Otherwise, she's decently townie by asking questions etc.
Marilyn M. I very much enjoy how townie she's acting, and most of her posts seem useful and relevant. However, I feel like she's defending O O. and praising Titus too much and it's kind of raising the possibility of her being a traitor cop who found out Titus and suspects O O. of being scum partners. 50-50 w/ her.
Hiroki, Yuzo, Nicolette, also known as the Neutral Trio. Hiroki is my only Neutral town though, because he at least explained away absence, whilst Yuzo and Nicolette are sort of dead.

I'd also like to let you all know that I'm going to my aunt's birthday party today, so I'll be gone for most of the day.




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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Nicolette D. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 10:14 am

i'm finally back tyvm, long post incoming
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Nicolette D. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 11:07 am

so here are some of my thoughts on a few d1 posts that nobody addressed as far as i'm aware, that i feel needed attention. the big takeaway that you should take from this post is that i don't understand at all why any of you townread titus.

Titus V. wrote:Hello there, it's my second post!

Well here's what I think. I usually like to scumhunt by putting myself in the mafia's shoes. So here goes: I doubt mafia really wants to lynch anyone day 1. Let's put it this way - it hurts more for them to lose a member than for town to lose a townie (unless vig). So I speculate that they might not lynch at all, or lynch someone that doesn't have plurality. Having said that, I will
Lynch Marilyn
for weak reasoning to unlynch.

this above post seems really good and all, and I think titus actually makes a good point here about scum mentality. but then like 2/3 posts later, this post comes up from a fellow player:

Claudina W. wrote:
Lila C. wrote:
Claudina W. wrote:
Teaque Q. wrote:
Linda G. wrote:Lynch Lila Z. it's y'all and I will personally hold this grudge until something actually of substance comes up. Additionally, you took my spot as the cutest avatar, and I'm going to hold THAT grudge against AJ for the rest of his career. If anybody has a decent wagon, let me know soon, so I can tell you exactly where to put that wagon, this is a goddamned CRUSADE against a heathen without any knowledge of how language or the established structure works.

Did I mention we're going hard this game?

This... feels really off to me. Kinda like "hey I'm gonna rvs, but if your rvs is better, I'll instaswitch, but remember, I'm playing well"

Could just be me but Lynch Linda G.

Not a valid reason to lynch imo. I have no clue yet tbh, I think the fun starts d2.
What do you mean it's not a valid reason to lynch lol? I'm not a huge fan of this post either, but considering that it's d1 and half the votes so far are from RVS, at least they're trying. If you think it's a bad idea to lynch Linda then you could at least bother to suggest someone yourself...

I'm just clueless ok. Most reasons to lynch day 1 are bullshit, and I'd rather not. **The problem is that I would want to NL, but this theme doesn't allow us to, as that gives scum time to find eachother.** Guess I'll have to go with my gut for now and Lynch Titus V.

especially coming right after your post about how scum wouldn't prefer to actively get someone lynched out of fear of killing off one of their partners, i find it really weird that you didn't respond or react to this post at all. what this makes me believe is that you're scum that wanted to keep claudina alive because they seemed like a partner, and you inspected them last night. as town, i think you would've pounced on claudina's scummy "i want to nl but i can't because that would help scum find their partners, but i'm not going to explain why i want to nl in the first place hahahahah" position in that post. claudina died and flipped town, but that's actually not even important to this argument, so don't bother bringing that up. what's important is that you didn't know claudina's alignment d1 going in to n1, you yourself chose not to actively go for the claudina lynch when they fit your scum criteria so well, and you instead let the amelia lynch go through, because they were a safer lynch (in the sense that they were less likely to be scum based on your post earlier). might as well mention that titus didn't bother to respond to marilyn either, when they justified their unlynch on teaque? and you didn't actively seek another lynch either afterwards, and thus fit your own criteria for scum by not actively pursuing a lynch. lynch titus v.

Titus V. wrote:
Lila C. wrote:
Titus V. wrote:Hello there, it's my second post!

Well here's what I think. I usually like to scumhunt by putting myself in the mafia's shoes. So here goes: I doubt mafia really wants to lynch anyone day 1. Let's put it this way - it hurts more for them to lose a member than for town to lose a townie (unless vig). So I speculate that they might not lynch at all, or lynch someone that doesn't have plurality. Having said that, I will
Lynch Marilyn
for weak reasoning to unlynch.
Also lmao, what even? "I doubt that scum will lynch today because they could lynch themselves".

Where exactly did I say that? All I am saying is mafia have no reason to aggressively push a lynch today because they have no need to risk lynching one of their partners.

Anyways, I suggest that as the game goes on a little bit everyone should make a read list ordering the players from most townie to most scummy. This way, we can see how everyone ranks every player. Since the mafia wants to avoid lynching scummy players since they don't want to target their own members, they would need to list those they suspect higher on the list (as more townie). Their lists might contradict a lot of town opinions so it might be helpful to help us scumhunt.

I won't let you even bring up the deadline in your argument either, because you made this post (and another one!) after claudina's scummy post, so you definitely read and had time to think about claudina's post as well. Also, suggesting a read list isn't even a towny play at all, since someone is bound to suggest it at a later time anyways, and actually seems to me like you were trying to gain more town cred than anything. I also don't agree with the sentiment that scum players would list their potential partners higher up on the list. in my opinion scum's best play is to play as townie as possible and gain town (and vig's) cred.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Nicolette D. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 11:31 am

Now for my thoughts on what's happened so far in d2.
I still don't understand why everyone's blindly townreading titus. if anyone has an argument other than "seems to have good ideas", let me know. or titus can respond to my above argument against them, but until then, my lynch on them stands.
I didn't think O. O.'s slip on vig itself was scummy, but the way they dealt with linda's case was scummy af. when it comes to slips themselves, I think lila's slip on mafia traitors is a lot scummier, since they indeed were the ones that bashed on another player for not checking the rolelist in the OP. also this:

Lila C. wrote:oh right my bad im stupid af

anyway I'd like to hear something of a bit more substance from Yuzo K., most of their posts so far have just been about the vig and how we should decide on kills iirc, any reads?

not only does lila brush off the slip, they try to divert attention away from themselves by calling out one of the afks? might i mention that i was also afk af until i made these posts after you made yours? so what made you target yuzo in particular, other than "it didn't matter who i targeted; i just wanted to get attention away from myself?" well i'm not letting that happen either way.

My top three scumreads at the moment are, in order of scummiest first, titus, lila, and o.o.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Titus V. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:07 pm

For Linda's sake, I will not quote Nicolette's long post but I will just summarize my thoughts here:

1) I did respond to Claudina's post. I said "I don't mind you lynching me but it would be nice if you said at least something about me rather "going with my gut" because I can't really reply to that."

2) Hiroki, Lila and Marilyn all posted after Claudina and none of them mentioned her post. By your logic, they must all be scum, since they didn't mention her scummy post?

3) Even if I had lynch Claudina, Amelia would still have plurality at 3 votes. I do not understand what you mean by me "choosing not to actively go for Claudina" when it would not have affected the outcome.

4) Why would I need to actively seek another lynch when I thought Marilyn was scummy?

5) Marilyn said: "I RL'd Teaque at the start of the day, but the wagons were all on different people at that point, so I unlynched while i made up my mind on which wagon to join". Well she didn't make up her mind on a wagon to join when she unlynched, so I felt like she is scummy. That's why I kept my vote on her.

Overall I like your post, but there are flaws in your argument.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Nicolette D. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:29 pm

1) point taken about responding to claudina. however, this doesn't address the fact that you didn't tackle what was obviously scummy behavior as detailed by your earlier post.

2) again, the important part is that you were the one that brought up that scumtell in the first place, and you didn't take action on someone who so obviously tripped said scumtell.

3) it might seem like i'm repeating the same point over and over, but you've seriously failed to address this point. you failed to take action against an obviously scummy action based on standards that you yourself set. it's not about whether you could've gotten claudina lynched or not; it's about how you failed to even mention how claudina's post was a perfect example of a scumtell. you haven't denied that claudina's post itself was scummy, and yet in your own response to her lynch on you, you just say "i don't have much to say when your lynch is a gut feeling," when you could've said so much more in conjunction with your scumtell post from earlier.

4+5) i feel like marilyn justified herself well enough on unlynching teaque, but that's just me. the fact still stands that you weren't really pushing the marilyn lynch either; you just let your vote stay without commenting much on it and let the plur on amelia go through.

i also despise the fact that you're trying to acknowledge my post quality, but give your half-hearted attempt at debunking my points, especially because you haven't addressed the most important issue at hand - you not addressing claudina's scumminess in reference to your scumtell post - when it was so easy for you to do. it seems like you're just trying to win me over and convince me that you're town. i'm not buying it. i'd appreciate everyone else give their two cents on this.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Titus V. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:41 pm

Nicolette D. wrote:1) point taken about responding to claudina. however, this doesn't address the fact that you didn't tackle what was obviously scummy behavior as detailed by your earlier post.

2) again, the important part is that you were the one that brought up that scumtell in the first place, and you didn't take action on someone who so obviously tripped said scumtell.

3) it might seem like i'm repeating the same point over and over, but you've seriously failed to address this point. you failed to take action against an obviously scummy action based on standards that you yourself set. it's not about whether you could've gotten claudina lynched or not; it's about how you failed to even mention how claudina's post was a perfect example of a scumtell. you haven't denied that claudina's post itself was scummy, and yet in your own response to her lynch on you, you just say "i don't have much to say when your lynch is a gut feeling," when you could've said so much more in conjunction with your scumtell post from earlier.

4+5) i feel like marilyn justified herself well enough on unlynching teaque, but that's just me. the fact still stands that you weren't really pushing the marilyn lynch either; you just let your vote stay without commenting much on it and let the plur on amelia go through.

i also despise the fact that you're trying to acknowledge my post quality, but give your half-hearted attempt at debunking my points, especially because you haven't addressed the most important issue at hand - you not addressing claudina's scumminess in reference to your scumtell post - when it was so easy for you to do. it seems like you're just trying to win me over and convince me that you're town. i'm not buying it. i'd appreciate everyone else give their two cents on this.

My point was simple: Mafias are reluctant to lynch because their lynch are riskier. If anything, Claudina's scummy behavior was "lynching for no reason despite saying it herself that lynches day 1 are bullshit". She never tripped any of my said scumtell. If she for example, said, I find Titus to be scummy because of these reasons YET do not lynch, now THAT's scummy. She did the opposite: lynching without saying why I am scummy. If you read my posts carefully, that is the total opposite of my scumtell. If Claudina was really mafia, why would she lynch for no reason? Surely it must be better to just lurk in the background. Please don't assume that if you think Claudina was scummy, I should too. Heck, I could push Marilyn if you want, I still think she's scummy especially when she said she uled because that was RVS and she had another lynch in mind, but the fact that she lynched Amelia just to save herself means she doesn't really have a target in mind.
Lynch Marilyn.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Titus V. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:56 pm

Also, just some thoughts for these players:

@O O: Can you please explain why you think Marilyn made a big deal of her unlynch? And why you think her unlynch was justified?

@Marilyn: Can you explain why you unlynch Teaque when he didn't have pluraity and you didn't have anyone else in mind?

@Nicolette: Perhaps you misunderstood my posts but Marilyn exactly tripped my scumtell "unlynching for no reason i.e not actively pushing" while Claudina did the opposite "lynching for no reason"

@Linda: I'm not sure whether these slips are enough of a reason to lynch someone over. They are surely great for starting a point though. Also, what particular part of Marilyn's defense do you like?

@Teaque: I actually didn't anticipate these readlists to start popping up so soon. When I said "as the game goes on" I actually meant like Day 3 or even 4. However, I do think we have enough discussions for now to make somewhat of a readlist at least for guidance. Mine will come soon.

@Lila: I want to hear some of your ideas. A read list would be perfect.

That's all for now folks!
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by Titus V. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:00 pm

Nevermind, that is not all for now. But I do think this point is important to mention!!!

Another scumtell is a sudden shift of reads. If mafia lynched someone, they might inspect that person, which would reveal whether they are actually mafia or town. Thus, if someone scumreads a person and just mysteriously backs off, it could be worth looking into. This is why a read-list is super important.

(Incoming replies be like: That's obvious! Stop trying to get town cred! Why would you reveal that info! Now mafia won't do that!)
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by O O. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:10 pm

Linda G. wrote:
this is what I meant with the underlined part, collapse ur quotes. that post is large AF to just ask for clarification over eight words.

the bolded part is essentially you did nothing D1, absolutely nothing. people can go back and check, D1 was less than two pages long. you come in late with some insight on yesterday, a day that's already over. then you check the thread more often than anyone else apparently, and help out Lila with setup talk. but then while pointing out the setup talk, you gloss over your own slip.
fair enough

i posted every time i came on and had something to say, which was exactly twice on the last day (not counting rl post because lol)
deadline hit before I got home and could see all the things said after my last post, and i commented with my opinion on the only topic there I thought would be relevant to today (along with the vig whoopsie)
if you're gonna fault me for that then that's your decision but I think it's a silly one

as to why i was checking the thread more often lately, two reasons: I was on public transportation with free wifi and nothing to do, and it's the 4th of july weekend so i've got some free time, unlike during the week when that isn't really the case.
missing that vig is 1shot after c/ping the text makes me feel extremely stupid but there's nothing i can really do about my own mistake; don't really see how that would get you any towncred since in the other situation where this happened (lila i think) I didn't/nobody else seems to have seen that as something that would give her towncred, just a mistake on her part.

Marilyn M. wrote:
When I posted it, I did feel like i was making a rather large deal out of it, but I was the counterwagon, and was a plurshift away from dying, so I think defending myself like that was justifiable
if you're not talking about the unlynch ignore me, but i don't see how that post of yours was a defense? It just seemed excessive in the way you did it. Didn't really see any sort of defense for yourself in there.

Teaque Q. wrote:
O O. wrote:
Linda G. wrote:insert content here
I get the rest so explain the bolded part pls thx
This quote right here is what kind of shuts down my ability to tr O O. He was working strong start of Day 2, but as soon as he got scum read, he just went with a short filler post made to seem long. I'm going to say it keeps him in my scum reads, but I'd like to wait for a defence at the very least since O O. hasn't given one yet, and the post makes it seem like he's making one. Currently: Convinced by Linda + O O.'s general scumminess, 80-20 scum town.
chill my dude, i want to know the full argument before even attempting to defend myself, so i asked for clarification


Titus V. wrote:
@O O: Can you please explain why you think Marilyn made a big deal of her unlynch? And why you think her unlynch was justified?
I don't really think that you need a solid reason to unlynch someone, especially on d1. her lynch was just an activity one (i assume) and unlynching was for the purpose of going to a better lynch (in this case one to save herself)
I think she made an excessive amount of like... emphasis on her lynch. It was like "I GUESS i'll unlynch Teaque even though he hasn't posted anything...." Reading it just seemed off and it felt kinda fake when I did so.

Titus V. wrote:Nevermind, that is not all for now. But I do think this point is important to mention!!!

Another scumtell is a sudden shift of reads. If mafia lynched someone, they might inspect that person, which would reveal whether they are actually mafia or town. Thus, if someone scumreads a person and just mysteriously backs off, it could be worth looking into. This is why a read-list is super important.

(Incoming replies be like: That's obvious! Stop trying to get town cred! Why would you reveal that info! Now mafia won't do that!)
That's obvious! Stop trying to get town cred! Why would you reveal that info! Now mafia won't do that!
I suppose I can redact my previous point about not needing a reason to unlynch, then. It still definitely stands for d1 though. Good point here by Titus overall, worth looking into why people unlynch others.
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by O O. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:18 pm

Linda G. wrote:
1) "But she also slipped, not knowing the mafia don't know each other, isn't that why you're lynching O O.?"
It is, but that happened while I was typing this up, and lila c actually had some good posts yesterday, as compared to O O. who didn't do much of anything, and is now trying to show that he does know things, by correcting her. Literally, his entire D1 was confirm, rand lynch, agree + change lynch. Coming out strong D2 isn't helping O O.'s case, whereas Lila's early D2 posts are an actual continuation of a D1 topic.
2) "Are you going to lynch O O. over something that they said at the beginning of the day, and not give any comments about what happened at the end of yesterday?"
Breaking this down into two parts: a) am I going to lynch O O. over beginning of day?
Yes. his posts yesterday were low effort, low quality, and led to a mislynch of a townie.
from your first point it seems like you're really just lynching me for my lack of utility d1 (understandable) and using the fuckup as an excuse?? also excuse me my day 1 was confirm, rand lynch, useful point about vig claiming, agree + change lynch, thank you very much.
The "Coming out strong" point is saying that I talked about a d1 topic, when you say you aren't lynching lila because... she continued talking about a day 1 topic? is the point you're making that I wasn't a part of the conversation on the topic that I brought up?? because if so, that's a terrible argument lol
mislynch of a townie - i lynched someone who only posted asking for the orl, which is literally located in the OP (not even in a spoiler tag!). Useless setup questions are something scum would do to make it seem like they're contributing without actually doing anything useful, which is why I agreed with whoever lynched her first and lynched her as well.

Please do correct me if im wrong, but your argument seems to have just sprung out of me messing up RE: maf vig and then trying to build a case on that. You said that me "coming out strong" isn't good. When i asked about what you meant, you said that I was talking about a day 1 topic and that I was posting a lot more than before. I explained why I was posting more, and the talking about a day 1 topic makes no sense to be part of a scumread given that you appear to be townreading Lila for doing the same thing? I also had exactly one good post + it's day 1 so I don't know what you were expecting from me. Most of the discussion occurred in the last day, when I didn't have a chance to check the thread.
not gonna restate what i already said via the other point(s?).
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

Post by O O. on Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:27 pm

nicolette, could you restate your argument more concisely / more simply? i've read it like four times and i dont know why but I just can't wrap my head around it
I do agree with the point that you're making that everyone townreading titus for just solid overall posts isn't really a good thing (although his posts ARE really good)
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Re: Game 30: Separated Scum

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