Re: Game 31: Separated Scum

by Mona L. Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:45 pm

Well I decided he was scummy enough to lynch based on actions already there, where I was still willing to give Rhonda a chance. Though at this point the only reason I haven't lynched her is because I don't want to hammer her and end the day early.

I don't know where you mentioned pressure, I am however 99% sure that I didn't just randomly started talking about pressure when that wasn't really my main goal. And if I did start the pressure talk then I was probably trying to do too much at once and didn't really think about what I was saying. So if you're right and I randomly started talking about pressure then I'm just as confused as you are.

Yeah I know you said you didn't believe it, but the thing you didn't believe is the correct interpretation.

Ed I literally told you that Maria is interpreting it right while you are interpreting it wrong. That's not something up for debate anymore because I, who made the post, have told you which one it is. I'm not sure what the point is of asking other people about this? Unless you want to justify your own misinterpretation or tell me that I am wrong about my own intentions? I'm just confused right now.

by Mona L. Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:47 pm

And also Ed, your post kind of got cut off? I'm not sure what's up with that.

by Roderick S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:58 pm

Ed S. wrote:Wilkinson put his vote on Rhonda, not Kodama.

Did you say Kodama had a "sense of genuinty" Day Two? I'll read back, but if so I either missed it or it didn't stand out to me as much at the time.I look forward to said read consolidation.

You mention, though, that the Rhonda wagon feels uncomfortable to join, but go on to join it. I'd be interested in hearing why. (Unlike Kodama earlier you have the knowledge that you'll be on longer, so there shouldn't be as much pressure to place a vote currently.)

Wilkinson put his vote on Rhonda, not Kodama

You been pressuring a pursing Wilkinson and Me To Come and Talk And even Go as Far to Scum read Wilkinson and this is all you have to say? me and Wilkinson was in the same position and its pretty different how you treated me then Wilkinson? i know you stated he isn't off the hook, but last time i check. he was a higher scum read then Rhonda the fact you didn't react as much when he lynch Rhonda is pretty strange. Thing is you been waiting for him to talk for days and this is how you respond to him coming online though he was a sub? Even Worse this is mylo/plylo

by Roderick S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:03 pm

Ed S. wrote:Okay, so while Roderick is taking a break, these are my current thoughts on him.

There's been noticable backtracking/contradiction in his posts, such as:
1) Mentioning that one of myself/Maria is scum but going on to say he doesn't want to make a claim like that yet regarding Mona/Rhonda. (I've asked about this, response is probably incoming.)
2) Mentioning that I'm more likely than Maria to be scum because she's been more helpful; but not giving examples and not really explaining when asked to go into more detail ("I think you both have been very helpful; I think you could be scum out of you and Maria" doesn't indicate what differentiation he's making between us

i must have done a bad job explaining my reads, No i do not think you are scum over maria because she/he more helpful. what kind of a reason is that, and if it make its less stressful I'll read you as a individual instead of a comparing you to someone else

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:10 pm

What are these forums.

Continuation of the last sentence: Mona’s word choice was different in that was an answer to a question I asked, which is likely why I was quicker to notice it.

Mona: I understand not wanting to hammer and end day early; I have no problem with this. As far as interpretations go, saying that one is "right" holds little value. Of course you believe a certain one to be "right", but Maria and I are currently the only ones to have commented on it. I'm not asking if I'm "right", I'm asking other people if they see what I mean, because if I'm not it may be the case that I'm tunneling.

Roderick: I never had him as a higher scum read than Rhonda, so I don't know where you're getting that idea. What do you find strange about my reaction?

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:16 pm

I'm not asking that you not compare me to someone else; I was asking if you could go into more detail with what differentiated myself and Maria. All you said was "Maria's been more helpful" without indicating what was helpful or why that made me more likely to be scum.

Granted, you're saying now that this is apparently not the case, in which case: what do you find that makes me more likely to be scum than Maria?

by Roderick S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:39 pm

Roderick S. wrote:but i think one of the scum are really tryna look town or acting town which is one of maria/ed S i'll say Ed Mostly as for now i would consider maria as a slight town read i do agree with them acting very helpful which would seem townie.

As far as my reads as a whole go, little has changed from the end of Day One. The overall order is Maria>Mona>Magnus>Roderick>Rhonda>Kodama>Mr. Honcho>Wilkinson. A better breakdown of it is below.

Maria (Town)
Mona (Town lean)
Magnus (Neutral, leaning town)
Roderick (Neutral)
Rhonda (Neutral, leaning scum)
Kodama (Scum lean)
Mr. Honcho (Scum)
Wilkinson (Scum)?[/quote]
This is where i got the idea from, im going to put your questions on hold for now as i go read Rhonda and mona also this is what i said so stop saying that i think ur scum out of the two cause of something you prob misunderstood my writing

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:50 pm

Unless I missed it, you've yet to differentiate between what made me scummier than Maria. You mention us townreading each other as possibly indicating scumbuddies (which it doesn't) but you have yet to explain what separates me from Maria in your reads. You say that you think I've been helpful as well, so it is just that you find Maria more helpful?

"Never" is an overstatement then. The point remains that I have a more recent readlist:

Ed S. wrote:I want to look at Kodama's posts once more and see if I can tell what "sense of genuinity" Maria is referring to (and also read over Mona/Rhonda's posts so far), but my current order from town>scum is Maria>Roderick>Wilkinson>Mona>Kodama>Rhonda, where Roderick and Wilkinson are mostly neutral due to a lack of content prior to now and their currently having subs.

Said reads have change since then as I've mentioned, but it's at this point basically a shift in places w/ you and Kodama. I moved Wilkinson to neutral when he got a sub, albeit I still had a scum lean on him (hence his being below you, who I had at the time as true neutral).

by Maria S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:51 pm

I am struggling to get what you mean by "If I was scum inspecting Kodama, I wouldn't need to bring that up to point out what I did."

I forgot to bring up why i felt it was schemed. You said in one of ur posts "i need another lynch on rhonda" with the reason of "she can easily get out of plurality" and ofc Kodama, ¡Had to be Kodama!, that executed this. (Yeah i am enjoying using ¡ now lol, hold Alt Gr and then the exclamation mark). Now you say he lynched his highest scumread which seems to be true but tbh you can easily engineer a readlist by cherrypicking stuff that has already been said plus add a little bit on maybe to make it look original, which is what i kinda feel when reading kodama's reads. But i also feel that when reading rhonda's reads too arrrgh!!! But yeah then Wilkinson just wagonned outta nowhere and i think what roderick meant is that your reaction was less aggressive or pushy than against say, idk, rhonda or anyone else you find thats scummy. Then you decided to announce the fact rhonda is on L-1 although this point is flawed coz there isnt really anyone to announce to, unless you were hoping roderick was scum and wilkinson/kodama genuinely agreed with you. Idk tho it seems like a stretch to me but i cant help feeling like i am being played like a fiddle.

by Maria S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:58 pm

Also mona u say you think both kodama and rhonda are both scum, so then why are you so torn? Surely in your perspective you have absolutely no worries in lynching either one?

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 6:08 pm

Basically if I was scum inspecting Kodama, I could have just been like "I want to read through his posts again." If I went in the the intention of forming a townread on Kodama, it wouldn't make sense to claim I was looking for genuinity and then not say, "Oh! I see what you mean now!" It's similar to what I mentioned Day One with Magnus's reaction test and how it didn't make sense for a scum!Magnus to admit to it not working as intended but still working.

I did call for another lynch on Rhonda so she couldn't shift plurality. I don't see what's wrong with that in itself, and I can't answer for Wilkinson/Kodama. (Speaking of Wilkinson, get back here. You said you'd be back in a couple of hours and it's been 8.) Mentioning someone to be at L-1 is a common thing to do, as it ensures that nobody accidentally hammers and ends the day early. (Also, I'm not sure what me thinking Roderick is scum has to do with that.)

Re: my reaction to Wilkinson, I'm pushing more on people that I find scummier. I was hoping he'd follow through on "being back on a couple of hours" so I could see the reads he promised and learn why he was so quick to lynch, but as mentioned above it's been 8 hours and there's nothing.

Also I don't think I can use the upside-down "!". Rest in peace, hopes and dreams.

by Wilkinson A. Mon Jul 10, 2017 6:35 pm

My being quick to lynch was me putting a vote on one guy, after already stating we should start considering our lynch targets. Unless this game is planning to start consolidating at 2 hours to DL, I don't think that planning for the lynch is wrong.

Wagon was the wrong choice of words on my part, I mean the support a lynch has

Ed S. is nice with his post activity and high quality of post content. I'm confident he's Town here.

Maria is also quite Towny, slightly less than Ed but still a solid TR

Mona had quite a few suspicious posts, which is why I considered voting them, and they aren't exactly being the most active gamesolver.

Similar to above, Roderick has the same problems,

And Rhonda refuses to come on, which is worse than me.

by Maria S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 6:36 pm

Maria S. wrote:Also mona u say you think both kodama and rhonda are both scum, so then why are you so torn? Surely in your perspective you have absolutely no worries in lynching either one?

I should probably make my point clearer here, you're absolutely right that hammering right now is silly coz you just cut precious discussion time. You already have your lynch on kodama and you say you're torn between kodama and rhonda yet you know you cant lynch rhonda anyway (you can, just not a good idea). So why the need to say you're torn between the two? Its a fair assumption that you arent changing your kodama lynch and you even said that both are scum in your eyes so in your perspective you're fine with either one getting lynched. It feels as though you said it in order to perhaps make us believe you arent buddying with rhonda. I mean it's fine to give reasons as to why you think both are scum which i thought is great but its the opening bit that i am not liking.

¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡

Ed: it's true you didnt have to, but doing so would make it more seemless imo, and perhaps you saying so would indicate that you have thought of this and decided to play around it. Although that just means we're diving into depth of wifom where we can never prove which is the right case.

It's a fairly weak reason coz i cant prove the intention and it might just be coincidental that kodama had to be the one that delivered. But idk like i said i just cant help but feel that some sort of scheme is going on. Also the roderick part was from a scum!Ed perspective.

by Maria S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 6:42 pm

Wilkinson A. wrote:My being quick to lynch was me putting a vote on one guy, after already stating we should start considering our lynch targets. Unless this game is planning to start consolidating at 2 hours to DL, I don't think that planning for the lynch is wrong.

Wagon was the wrong choice of words on my part, I mean the support a lynch has

Ed S. is nice with his post activity and high quality of post content. I'm confident he's Town here.

Maria is also quite Towny, slightly less than Ed but still a solid TR

Mona had quite a few suspicious posts, which is why I considered voting them, and they aren't exactly being the most active gamesolver.

Similar to above, Roderick has the same problems,

And Rhonda refuses to come on, which is worse than me.

Yeah but i was saying that you said "i'll post my reads and decide who to vote" or something like that even tho you voted already. Also you really didnt improve on your initial post of "reads", you effectively just town/scumread everyone based on activity despite being nearly 3 whole days now.

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 6:55 pm

Wilkinson: The "one guy" you lynched happened to have two votes on them already. Planning for who to lynch isn't wrong, but that doesn't mean you instantly have to place one, especially if it's putting someone at L-1. (If someone who hadn't voted yet was a Traitor with a town inspect on Rhonda, it would have been gg.) People have been considering their lynch targets all day.

You left out Kodama in your reads. Most of the ones you do have seem to be sheeping the consensus with one liners, which I'm not comfortable with.

Similar to what I asked Roderick, what makes Maria slightly less townie than me?

Maria, if you're worried now about wifom in that, why didn't you bring uip the possibility of wifom earlier when I was discussing Magnus's reaction test?

Until I have a clear answer on Wilkinson's quick vote, I'm going to Unvote Rhonda R. I still want her defense and will likely go back on if she doesn't give it/isn't at L-1 later. Despite heavily scumreading Rhonda I don't like Wilkinson's one-line readlist and handwaving away his quick vote. It comes across as scum who has found an easy push.

by Maria S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:18 pm

Rip this is gonna have to be my last post and i aint got much time to write it but basically i feel its odd that rhonda hasnt decided to come online despite being pressured and i would have thought that a scum would want to defend themself rather than just not doing anything since from what i've seen from rhonda she would know full well that not posting just makes it worse. This contrasts Kodama using data and hotspot and stuff to get his posts out which could either be dedication or just trying to not be lynched for that day. I really dont know but i think i am gonna lynch kodama coz i feel as though he's more likely to be maf due to reasons i've already said and just gut really. Also i dont think roderick is scum.

ul rod, lynch kodama

by Roderick S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:31 pm

Rhonda R. wrote:
Roderick/Wilkinson: Holding off judgement on these two since they were just subbed in and neither of their predecessors said anything of substance.

1) i would like to see your judgement as of now if u do ever suppose do go on online
2) its seems like This lynching is turning into a policy lynch for lurking for days and being inactive. people say they spotted you online and posted nothing also that you have plur and not coming on as people want you to so you can defend yourself. so i dont really town read this player but this lynch can decide the game for us which i am worry about which is why i want walkin lynch over, i also do believe he is a better one. but you kinda did this to yourself
3)i feel more confront-able with Wilkins Lynch over This one

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:45 pm

Now it's my turn to be torn.

In addition to what has been mentioned re: my unlynching Rhonda, I also wanted to see if Mona would follow through on lynching. I have questions about Maria's unlynch and subsequent lynch, but she possibly won't be back on. I am still also in no way confident about Rhonda being able to shift.

I will vote Rhonda R. and put her back at L-1 while screaming internally.

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:50 pm

Also, deadline is in ~1 hour. As far as Rhonda continuing to not respond goes, she has been on to see everything save page 11. A town!Rhonda would unquestionably defend herself at this point, while the chance of a scum!Rhonda trying to wifom her way out of this still exists. This is one of the issues I have with Maria's vote-Rhonda knows that not posting is making things worse for her, so how does her decision to not post make her more likely to be town?

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:58 pm

There is an increasing chance that I will not be able to be online at deadline. If there is anything at all anyone would like to tell me, now is the time to do so.

by Roderick S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:59 pm

Mona L. wrote:
Roderick S. wrote:
Mona L. wrote:So, reads.

Ed: Ed has been very active and doesn't act very scummy, though I do have to say that he has a tendency to say similar things that for example Maria had already pointed out a few hours earlier. I still think that he's more likely to be a towny who just sometimes feels the need to say something even though he doesn't know anything to say. Leaning town.

(Kodama's quote was here)

So im looking at these post as you read them as town because they seem townie/not scummy. what i dont get what makes them town beside there activity(goes for everyone who place a town read on them) cause anyone can ask questions and answer quickly. is there something about there answers? or what type of questions they ask Cause we Have people in the past Who were scummy/inactiveness which i would say is a form of scummyness in the game. Who all flipped town, what does that say for the people who arent scummy? but i would say its mafia criteria to be looked as town. though im sure there still player that are scummy are actually scum but i think one of the scum are really tryna look town or acting town which is one of maria/ed S i'll say Ed Mostly as for now i would consider maria as a slight town read i do agree with them acting very helpful which would seem townie. Also i have anyone of yall even bothered to question any of them. from what i seen i just see your interactions be about something else this is just remember half the post i seen thought im not to sure if this is true so correct me if im wrong i been think about this for 2 hours straight roughly so i dont really to go back and check plus the clock is ticking. i did have a lot to say about something might of slip my mind at the time but hopefully this is everything regarding this topic...um ok idk if its me but the last post had some missing info im going fix it in this post(updated as well as some spelling fixed)

Honestly when it's just about general posts I can't really say what makes me believe people are town or scum? It's one of my biggest weaknesses as I can often figure out whether a town leader is town or scum by the way they talk, but because I can't explain it I can't convince anyone when they're actually scum. I can only really explain myself well when someone's actions are quite obviously scummy.

I haven't questioned Ed a lot, because to me it seems like he genuinely just did not get what I was trying to say. The entirety of what he does and says seems like someone genuinely trying to help town and scumhunt to me. I haven't found anything particularly scummy that he did, and actions seem to be our biggest form of scumhunting in this game. I'm not sure how I could actually explain my read on him and maria though? It's one of the many things I have in my head which I can't quite put into words. I hope this at least clarified something? If you want me to try and elaborate more do say so.

you said "I haven't found anything particularly scummy that he did, and actions seem to be our biggest form of scum hunting in this game" well sometimes that may be the reason and i agree he does but is that a good enough reason to qualify him as a town read? have you though of scum hunting him? also out of all the scummy players that died guess what. THEY WERE ALL TOWN. i think were going have to go in more deeper to read such player especially this game, since this game has it fair share of scummy players. dont get me wrong people who are it happen if it every even if you cant prove them being scummy still can be scum but ask yourself? is this person really town/scum because they are or not scummy?. i mean look at me im going against the so called town leader. i just dont like a town read on someone just because of "not being scummy" i mean like all mafia go for so maybe thats why theres still so many alive

by Ed S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:03 pm

Question I have for Roderick that I really should have asked earlier: You've mentioned a couple of time talking about things like "I think we're going to have to go in deeper," which implies that the game will go on past today. Considering that we are in MyLo, this is not necessarily the case. Is there a reason for this?

Also I don't get your last post at all. It reads like you're implying that because mafia will actively try to not by scummy, people who are scummy are town. Correct me if I am wrong.

by Roderick S. Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:04 pm

Mona L. wrote:
Roderick S. wrote:
Mona L. wrote:So, reads.

Ed: Ed has been very active and doesn't act very scummy, though I do have to say that he has a tendency to say similar things that for example Maria had already pointed out a few hours earlier. I still think that he's more likely to be a towny who just sometimes feels the need to say something even though he doesn't know anything to say. Leaning town.

(Kodama's quote was here)

So im looking at these post as you read them as town because they seem townie/not scummy. what i dont get what makes them town beside there activity(goes for everyone who place a town read on them) cause anyone can ask questions and answer quickly. is there something about there answers? or what type of questions they ask Cause we Have people in the past Who were scummy/inactiveness which i would say is a form of scummyness in the game. Who all flipped town, what does that say for the people who arent scummy? but i would say its mafia criteria to be looked as town. though im sure there still player that are scummy are actually scum but i think one of the scum are really tryna look town or acting town which is one of maria/ed S i'll say Ed Mostly as for now i would consider maria as a slight town read i do agree with them acting very helpful which would seem townie. Also i have anyone of yall even bothered to question any of them. from what i seen i just see your interactions be about something else this is just remember half the post i seen thought im not to sure if this is true so correct me if im wrong i been think about this for 2 hours straight roughly so i dont really to go back and check plus the clock is ticking. i did have a lot to say about something might of slip my mind at the time but hopefully this is everything regarding this topic...um ok idk if its me but the last post had some missing info im going fix it in this post(updated as well as some spelling fixed)

Honestly when it's just about general posts I can't really say what makes me believe people are town or scum? It's one of my biggest weaknesses as I can often figure out whether a town leader is town or scum by the way they talk, but because I can't explain it I can't convince anyone when they're actually scum. I can only really explain myself well when someone's actions are quite obviously scummy.

I haven't questioned Ed a lot, because to me it seems like he genuinely just did not get what I was trying to say. The entirety of what he does and says seems like someone genuinely trying to help town and scumhunt to me. I haven't found anything particularly scummy that he did, and actions seem to be our biggest form of scumhunting in this game. I'm not sure how I could actually explain my read on him and maria though? It's one of the many things I have in my head which I can't quite put into words. I hope this at least clarified something? If you want me to try and elaborate more do say so.

you said "I haven't found anything particularly scummy that he did, and actions seem to be our biggest form of scum hunting in this game" well sometimes that may be the reason and i agree he does but is that a good enough reason to qualify him as a town read? have you though of scum hunting him? also out of all the scummy players that died guess what. THEY WERE ALL TOWN. i think were going have to go in more deeper to read such player especially this game, since this game has it fair share of scummy players. dont get me wrong people who are it happen if it every even if you cant prove them being scummy still can be scum but ask yourself? is this person really town/scum because they are or not scummy?. i mean look at me im going against the so called town leader. i just dont like a town read on someone just because of "not being scummy" i mean like all mafia go for so maybe thats why theres still so many alive

by Kodama N. Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:07 pm

Wilkinson A. wrote:Ok Rhonda, not Roderick.
Re: the pressure voting case, I don't feel like you have to put plurality on the guy, but a single file stray vote is also ignorable, and stating your intent further worsens the situation. Right now it's going to be tough to get reads out of people so I think here it's best to gather people for a lynch since I don't trust in the activity of humans.

Right now I'm torn between Mona, Rhonda and Roderick, they all have reasonable genuinity in their wagon but Roderick just seems really iffy to me.
RN the Rhonda wagon doesn't feel comfortable just to join given the presence of other players, but Mona feels even worse to join so yeah.

It's LyLo and we really have to vote, so Vote Rhonda.

I'm going to stay on there for a while before I more thoroughly consolidate my own reads.

As many have said, I don't like how he joined Rhonda's BW just based on Roderick/Mona's wagon feels "iffy" or "worse than Rhonda's", I would unlynch Rhonda because of this, but I don't want Rhonda to come on and just plurshift onto me last second.

Maria S. wrote:Rip this is gonna have to be my last post and i aint got much time to write it but basically i feel its odd that rhonda hasnt decided to come online despite being pressured and i would have thought that a scum would want to defend themself rather than just not doing anything since from what i've seen from rhonda she would know full well that not posting just makes it worse. This contrasts Kodama using data and hotspot and stuff to get his posts out which could either be dedication or just trying to not be lynched for that day. I really dont know but i think i am gonna lynch kodama coz i feel as though he's more likely to be maf due to reasons i've already said and just gut really. Also i dont think roderick is scum.

ul rod, lynch kodama

Firstly, most of your reasoning in this post is just wifom about whether town/scum would defend or not. Secondly, yes I did just personally want to come on and post something as normally I have nothing else better to do.

Maria S. wrote:I'll post my list when I have a more solid idea on the order which for me should come clear as this day progresses. In terms of your scumteam proposal i dont have too much to say except for the fact that I dont really agree that mona going back to day 1 to give a reason against kodama means mona is buddying rhonda since there's nothing wrong with using info from any day to form a read as long as it's valid.

Thirdly, you never posted your reads, and it's nearly deadline and everything should be "clear" since the "day has progressed" a lot (with Wilkinson posting, etc.) and fourthly, you really never did mention me in your recent posts (well at least, alignment indicative) and the only thing I remember is you saying that you found a "sense of genuity" in my posts. Though, as you said this is the last post you could write, I really can't get your comment on this.

by Kodama N. Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:08 pm

I can be online for the rest of the duration until deadline, so you can ask me any questions you want and I should respond in a reasonable amount of time.

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